open minded.

I am glad to see such tolerance, I am struggling with some fellow humans in my life on similar grounds. But they are actually trying to indoctrinate me and will not listen when I ask them to stop, I am not sure of what I am going to do, and I do not want to be overly harsh.

When one cannot stand on there own two and call on the aid of another to fill in the gaps of belief, and reinforce ones unknowing, that is a sign that introspection is needed. We may all have our times to need to do such, I guess it is a process of growth. If the introspection does not occur than one may be stepping backwards, or at best stagnate until one lets go and free's the mind.

I know in the past I have been in a state where I could not see over the wall of my preconcieved notions and attachments of need, to feel I knew through belief, for a brief period, and the only one it was hurting was me, it seems that being nice can do more harm, and being honest is really having good intentions and doing another a favor, we seem to learn through trial and error.

All one can do is lay it out as clear as possible for others, and if one truly has an open mind, then it will be understood eventually, our ego and defensive mechanism seems to be our worst enemy if we seek truth and love for all, the world has seen much blood over these issues of religion and "truth", most is from blind belief, and fanatacism.

It seems the only thing permenent is change.

i love god and i love truth ,and i do believe there is absolute truth ,i also believe alot of which we can not fully realise until we are free from the cage of humanity. i know myself, i know what god has shown me.and i as well cannot stand indoctrination as i have also stated many times and in other places. it is with the love and patience that we can reach others coupled with deep prayer for the people we are dealing with also deep prayer for our own being to stay CHRIST LIKE as we encounter these difficult situations.christ had thousands of followers not just the 12 that was the inner cicrle ,he also had a deeper esoteric level with the three Jon peter and James, i also believe wiyh judas, all according to there own level of understandings with the women he taught. He taught and still does teach people according to there ability to understand, that is how we are supposed to do it as well.I also believe judgment begins in the house of the lord , this can be seen as within self first but also the church who will most definitely will be judged . we are coming into these times the spiritual ,political world situation are ripe. Christ loves people who are trapped in ignorance and waiting to be freed
that is my mission field ,there are so many people waiting to find god in the church and to refrain from going there for me would be leaving people in bonds that Christ can free them from ,by using me . the pastor of my church knows i call my self a gnostic and i also believe he is awake and aware as many many times he has talked of his personal embarrassment of church history. i also believe as i started to say above we are living in apocryphal times and time is of the essence

Iehi writes:
All one can do is lay it out as clear as possible for others, and if one truly has an open mind, then it will be understood eventually, our ego and defensive mechanism seems to be our worst enemy if we seek truth and love for all, the world has seen much blood over these issues of religion and "truth", most is from blind belief, and fanatacism.

You have stated a very truthful realization for yourself Brother. My end quote to all my post with being a dove is my and everyones cross within different points of view to bare for Him. Some years back I ran into the same view as you, thinking I needed to get everyone, especially those that are close to see the things I now see and even believe in truth.
Donot seek to fill the gap within yourself of things or men of this world, you will be sorrly let down and open to attack by Samual(Satan) who owns this world. But seek to be full in the Father by way of instructions of Christ(Kistos) with the power of the Spirit and your words You say are true Iehi
lay it out as clear as possible for others from that point of view for oneself, their will be no gap left to fill. Thier Spirit will hear you which is of God always, regardless if they are tapping into it, If, and only if they have a degree of open mindedness thier own Mind and Body through that Spirit will give them their free will choice to accept it, as all men have. Either way, You have performed the 100% deeds of that You sought, From Your enlightened Spiritual point of veiw. The degree of fullness you started at will be shown to you, by the father always. Find Joy in an enlightment, Find endurance with rebuke or blasphamy. With the later for me. I now smile with God and realize how much more Love is needed in the world of Men. Not as thier Greater in this world of flesh, but as a servent to the Spirit of God within them, as also is in you. When Jesus stated He was the Son of man, He was reffering to man in His fulness of the Father which is the greatest we can achieve. To endure the rebuke from Men not wanting the Father, all will be delt that which we are due at the consumation. As a Prophet will get a prophets reward and so on.
Iehi... it does get rough Bro LOL .. I agree and feel it also.
I do try to keep things Happy, as in jokes and the amount of similar traits and things with each Soul you may have. There is one word that equals pages and pages of theology and discussion and that word is Love. But Love given in Haste will be attacked with fervencey. This is why so many are veil also, they dare not to step up to the firing line so to speak. The gosple of Thomas He states: " remember the closer you are to me, the closer you are to the fire"

So as we go through the revalations of things in the world of the mixure, that is why the truth in the father needs to be built upon within us, so we will have ample tools to perform the things we wish to do in Him realy easy huh? LOLOL Not sometimes..

I better go before I have to publish this.... LOL
As a feather rests upon the ground from being blown along its journey, so shall love due with Us.

Peace in your hearts

Brother Tom

Although I have not been here that long, almost twenty eight years, it does infact seem that these times are heading toward something, and I hope it's for the good, but it may get worse before it gets better.

I went to a Catholic church class for adults a few years or more back, and they seemed understanding and tolerant of other religions, atleast when I was talking about them. I really think it was messed up that they burned the library at Alexandria, and the inquisition, and I wonder what is stored away in the vatican that remains hidden, if anything. I heard the new pope is not anything like the previous and he is intolerant of other faiths.

Before I went out to "save" I would want to Know mySelf and be sure, I am not aiming this at anyone here, but take a look if you wish.


Look at the fanatacism with this person!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1354937832347125289&q=wife+swap+christian&total=18&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0


Also this film Jesus camp, makes me sad to see innocent children subjected to brainwashing.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1031193821250574185&q=Jesus+camp&total=2406&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=1

Hey Bro. Thomas,

I guess I was misleading in that, I was more so talking about others, trying to get others to realize the Belief may be tainted.

I in no way want to get others to believe as me, because they would not be believing much,lol.

I was trying to give a message in the most unoffensive way.

If I lay things out it is not about beliefs in religion, it's more so about reason and logic, I have a problem in believing, because it seems so dubious.

I just started learning of good sayings from the scriptures from you guys , before I knew about the Kingdom of heaven is within you, the returning to children to enter the kingdom, and some parts in the bible like Matthew 6, about the treasure within and the light when the eye becomes single.

Now I have more than ever pointed out to me from this forum, I think it is useful when discussing things with people that need to see it's in scripture, like my friends that like to sit around and talk about it, I don't push things like that on people.

This lady I know has been telling me all this stuff like she knows it all, but it seems she has just chosen her views from scriptures and thinks all I have to do is blindly believe, and I am saved. I tried to tell her I am about methods to experience, and could care less about blindly believing books,I do not like that stuff. And I asked her to stop and she keeps sending me letters and calling leaving messages that she is trying to save me, I know she probably thinks she is right and she knows, but I know I don't know, and am working on it a bit more realistically.

Also this film Jesus camp, makes me sad to see innocent children subjected to brainwashing.

It saddens me, too, to see children being conditioned. What makes me so sad is watching their egos begin to develop. But I try to keep in mind,that all beings are, in truth, incorruptible. I had in mind, about children being corrupted by world through t.v. and ignorance from their mentors in general, when I read some Philip K. Dick talking about himself being upset seeing his children watching t.v., when he came to this realization as well, that they are truly incorruptible.

Iehi Aur wrote:This lady I know has been telling me all this stuff like she knows it all, but it seems she has just chosen her views from scriptures and thinks all I have to do is blindly believe, and I am saved. I tried to tell her I am about methods to experience, and could care less about blindly believing books,I do not like that stuff. And I asked her to stop and she keeps sending me letters and calling leaving messages that she is trying to save me, I know she probably thinks she is right and she knows, but I know I don't know, and am working on it a bit more realistically.

Unfortunately the world is full of people who believe that they know best. That goes for politicians, scientists, atheists, and religionists ~ EVERYONE! But perhaps the most stubborn and prideful are the religionists.

I was brought up with nominally Christian values/indoctrination. I think everyone is indoctrinated into one or other religions. This is one big obstacle we must all overcome. We will never truly see each other as equals if we see each other (OR OURSELVES) as Jews, or Christians, or Muslims, or Hindus, etc.

I am sure that Yehoshua never saw Himself is such ways!

PLU ~ Bob

I think everyone is indoctrinated into one or other religions. This is one big obstacle we must all overcome. We will never truly see each other as equals if we see each other (OR OURSELVES) as Jews, or Christians, or Muslims, or Hindus, etc.

In some ways, I amextremely lucky in that respect. For my mother is very (seemingly) anti-religious. So i was never conditioned to any religion. BUT, there are other ways in which one is conditioned, and this is possibly worse. For I was conditioned in the ways of Pride. When I first turned towards Christ, I held hatred for my mother, seeing the ways in which she helped develop my ego. Also, I thought that she should've raised me with more morals, but then I also thought moral conditioning causes alot of children to rebel against that, developing pride and seeing their parents as stupid. So for ths reason I am glad I wasn't raised w/ strict Bible and Moral Conditioning, for I was free to seek on my own(w/ help from the Spirit, too, of course)